17 Oct
2016
17 Oct
'16
9:07 p.m.
Hello baseband hacking folks,
I have heard several people complain that they are no longer able to
find/obtain a Motorola C1xx phone or any other Calypso device for
playing with OsmocomBB. I assume these complaints probably come from
people in the EU and other 900/1800 MHz regions, as US band C139 phones
are still readily available on ebay (63 listings as of right now, all
dirt cheap), but either way, I have what I believe to be the proper
solution to the shortage and the crippled nature of all pre-existing
Calypso devices: a new Calypso board.
Back in 2012 Harald Welte posted here saying that his company was
going to be making a new Calypso board for the very same purpose of
addressing the shortage and the deficiencies of pre-existing devices,
but as far as I know, no such product has ever been produced - nor do
I know if whoever was behind that project even got as far as creating
the design for it.
Fast-forwarding to the present, we now have a ready-to-build design
for a Calypso development board called FCDEV3B, which stands for
FreeCalypso development board, triband. It is based on a reuse of the
known-working Calypso modem design from Openmoko, reuse at the level
of physical PCB layout, based on the GTA02 design files which Openmoko
founder Mr. Sean Moss-Pultz released in April of 2015 at my urging.
Back in 2012 Harald was saying that he was only going to release PDF
schematics but not the full design files for his board; I feel
differently about such matters, hence the complete design files for
*my* board are free to the world:
ftp://ftp.freecalypso.org/pub/GSM/FreeCalypso/fcdev3b/
Now we need to get these boards physically made, and toward that end I
have started a crowdfunding campaign:
https://www.gofundme.com/fcdev3b-board-production-2umevjw
In the interest of transparency, I have to disclose (most people know
it already, but I have to state it anyway) that I do not use OsmocomBB
and will never contribute to Osmocom software because I am working on
my own personally preferred alternative GSM MS firmware implementation,
but when it comes to the hardware I seek to build and offer to the
community, there is no reason why it won't work with OsmocomBB - it
should work just fine.
Because my board is a derivative of Openmoko's modem design and the
part that is different between Openmoko's board and mine (the flash
chip - I will populate a higher-capacity chip on the same footprint)
is not used by OsmocomBB software, the images currently built in
board/gta0x/*.highram.bin should work as-is on my FCDEV3B without
needing any code changes.
Hasta la Victoria, Siempre,
M~
19 Oct
19 Oct
10:19 p.m.
Hi Mychaela,
On Mon, Oct 17, 2016 at 11:07:26AM -0800, Mychaela Falconia wrote:
I believe to be the proper solution to the shortage
and the crippled
nature of all pre-existing Calypso devices: a new Calypso board.
To be fair: It is *a* solution, unfortunately not one accessible to all
people. The price of the C1xx phones at the height of their
availability some 5 years ago was in the range of 10-20 USD, which is
something never achievable with any new board if not only due to the
economics of scale.
Back in 2012 Harald Welte posted here saying that his
company was
going to be making a new Calypso board for the very same purpose of
addressing the shortage and the deficiencies of pre-existing devices,
I will re-read the mails, but as far as I remember it, there was some
intention and some plans, but I do not recall having made a firm
committment that we definitely will do it. As usual, life happens and
there are many other interesting projects to work on. I personally and
"my" company have been working ever since to create more and more FOSS
for cellular communications - with a focus on the network /
infrastructure side.
but as far as I know, no such product has ever been
produced - nor do
I know if whoever was behind that project even got as far as creating
the design for it.
I know of one company who has created a proprietary calypso-based
design (not for public sale), but neither I nor sysmocom were involved
in that.
Fast-forwarding to the present, we now have a
ready-to-build design
for a Calypso development board called FCDEV3B, which stands for
FreeCalypso development board, triband.
This is great news. I have been occasionally following your efforts,
and it is great to see those efforts culminating at this point.
Back in 2012 Harald was saying that he was only going
to release PDF
schematics but not the full design files for his board; I feel
differently about such matters,
This is a misrepresentation. I do not "feel" differently. The point
was simply that at that time, Openmoko Inc still existed, and there
was confidentiality on the GSM modem part of the GTA01/GTA02 phone
designs. So I simply didn't have any authority to decide on that, no
matter wat my feelings were.
It's great that you got permission to disclose that layout - three years
later.
Now we need to get these boards physically made, and
toward that end I
have started a crowdfunding campaign:
https://www.gofundme.com/fcdev3b-board-production-2umevjw
Great! I have pitched USD 450 in to see how this bord turns out in
reality. I think it should be relatively easy to get 9 more people
chip in to turn this into realaity.
We also still have 100 units of calypso, iota and rita chips in stock at
sysmocom, which we'd happily donate to your project if you were
interested.
Regards,
Harald
--
- Harald Welte <laforge(a)gnumonks.org> http://laforge.gnumonks.org/
============================================================================
"Privacy in residential applications is a desirable marketing option."
(ETSI EN 300 175-7 Ch. A6)
20 Oct
20 Oct
12:10 a.m.
Hi Harald,
To be fair: It is *a* solution, unfortunately not one
accessible to all
people. The price of the C1xx phones at the height of their
availability some 5 years ago was in the range of 10-20 USD,
Actually the US band C139s are *still* available at these prices on
ebay today; dunno about EU band ones though.
My personal reasons for seeking to build my own FreeCalypso board have
more to do with these phones' extremely crippled nature, rather than
their shortage. My FreeCalypso software puts more demands on its
underlying hw target than OsmocomBB, and a C1xx phone can never be a
fully satisfactory replacement for Openmoko's modem for FreeCalypso
purposes. I want a hardware platform on which my FreeCalypso work can
shine at its full brightness, hence FreeCalypso hardware.
But I also heard many complaints from people who said they could NOT
get a Mot C1xx phone for the purpose of playing with OsmocomBB, thus I
thought that perhaps my board project could benefit not only the FC
community, but OsmocomBB as well.
which is
something never achievable with any new board if not only due to the
economics of scale.
Absolutely true.
I will re-read the mails, but as far as I remember it,
there was some
intention and some plans, but I do not recall having made a firm
committment that we definitely will do it.
I don't think I said that you made a firm commitment, but the
announcement of those plans on this list did generate a lot of
excitement and interest.
As usual, life happens and
there are many other interesting projects to work on.
I have Asperger Syndrome, which causes me to remain focused on one
single project for years on end. But I do realize that most "normal"
people don't have the same kind of single-minded focus.
I personally and
"my" company have been working ever since to create more and more FOSS
for cellular communications - with a focus on the network /
infrastructure side.
I very much appreciate your work on the network / infrastructure side,
as I suspect that it may become vital when the greedy uncaring major
network operators shut down their GSM/2G services. When that happens,
those of us who absolutely require GSM/2G in order to live happy and
meaningful lives will have to set up our own networks, and that is
where your work on that side will come in very handy.
I know of one company who has created a proprietary
calypso-based
design (not for public sale), but neither I nor sysmocom were involved
in that.
I know (or I should say suspect) at least two, one of which is likely
the same one you know of. They contacted me asking if I could make
AMR work for them in OsmocomBB, with the uplink TCH/AFS (or TCH/AHS
perhaps) bits coming from their external host instead of the
microphone-fed internal vocoder, and I told them that (1) I only work
on FreeCalypso sw and not OsmocomBB, and (2) I don't know if what they
wanted is even possible without *Massive* DSP reverse eng work to
produce a special DSP patch, so that was the end of the story. But
they did mention to me that they had their own Calypso board, although
I have no idea how it differs from mine or from a C1xx phone.
The other company which I suspect is also building their own Calypso-
based hardware for use inside their closed world and not for the
general public is the anonymous company who did the FCDEV3B PCB design
in Altium - they did this work for me on a barter basis in exchange
for some consulting work I did for them, which consisted of extensive
hand-holding help with FreeCalypso sw on GTA02 devices - apparently
they are building something GTA02-based, but I can only guess, and
your guess would be as good as mine. They are anonymous in that I
myself don't know who they are - they never told me.
This is a misrepresentation. I do not
"feel" differently. The point
was simply that at that time, Openmoko Inc still existed, and there
was confidentiality on the GSM modem part of the GTA01/GTA02 phone
designs. So I simply didn't have any authority to decide on that, no
matter wat my feelings were.
Well, Prometheus did not have any authority from Zeus to give Fire to
Humankind either, but he did it anyway. Every time you cook something
on a fire or warm your house with one, say thanks to the greatest NDA
breaker of all times!
Great! I have pitched USD 450 in to see how this bord
turns out in
reality.
I've already sent you an off-list thank-you note, but here I reiterate
my thanks for your donation publicly!
I think it should be relatively easy to get 9 more
people
chip in to turn this into realaity.
I hope so...
We also still have 100 units of calypso, iota and rita
chips in stock at
sysmocom,
The exact same number I have in my own stash - what a coincidence. :)
which we'd happily donate to your project if you
were
interested.
Thanks, I'll keep you in mind if my own stash ever proves insufficient
and I have difficulty getting more from the Chinese market.
M~
2758
days inactive
2760
days old
baseband-devel@lists.osmocom.org
2 comments
2 participants
participants (2)
-
Harald Welte -
Mychaela Falconia