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Harald Welte laforge at osmocom.orgHi Andrew, On Sat, Apr 25, 2020 at 04:48:13PM +0100, Andrew Back wrote: > The documentation suggests overlay networks support SCTP now: > Not sure about bridge networks. Well, as soon as you have an actual Layer3 or Layer2 network, for sure you can use SCTP. > Various vendors seem to be using Docker in NFV/SDN architectures I am convinced that either they must be building their own "network drivers/plugins" to docker, or they can not implement 2G/3G 3GPP interfaces as we know them. This is not an Osmocom specific topic. > would be nice to think there will be a way forward, which does not mean > that we end up with a dichotomy, whereby other infrastructure is part of > that world and Osmocom excluded. Be it through compliance tooling and > best practices, plus Docker improvements — or whatever it takes. Honestly, I seriously don't think that Docker is the right tool. It is actively hostile towards anyone doing anything serious in terms of networking. It is already an enormous nightmare to model the most trivial of networking topologies. It is centered around dns and dynamic IP addresses, while classic 2G/3G is based around static IP addresses everywhere. You cannot have SS7/SIGTRAN on a container that gets a dynamic IP address via DHCP. I could imagine that other container runtimes with a less monolithic and more modular approach might be more amenable to the requirements of 3GPP networks, but I lack any hands-on experience with that. Docker is just trying to solve too many things at the same time, without giving users the kind of tools/access to the underlying infrastructure. Just take the example about no way to get persistent network device naming: https://github.com/moby/moby/issues/25181 https://github.com/docker/compose/issues/4645 Similarly, there is no functionality in Docker how you can move a physical network device into a specific container. Peaple have built kludges/workarounds for that (https://github.com/jpetazzo/pipework) but that's not Docker itself. There are so many things people have been able to do for decades with the Linux network stack on bare metal, and which they still can do with Linux e.g. in lxc containers that I assume no Docker developer has even imagined possible. It's like you used to have a full mechanical workshop available, an Docker then arbitrarily limits this to a set of three philips screw drivers because that's what most people need ;) Just because some people in the industry have heard some buzzwords and think that Docker is the right tool to virtualize 3GPP network elements doesn't mean that we have to agree :) Sorry, I've already wasted way too many days of my life trying to work around random arbitrary constraints of docker networking :/ -- - Harald Welte <laforge at osmocom.org> http://laforge.gnumonks.org/ ============================================================================ "Privacy in residential applications is a desirable marketing option." (ETSI EN 300 175-7 Ch. A6)